Just to be clear, I am taking the conceal carry course within the next two weeks but have a question to decipher an apparent contradiction in state law.
This posting:
http://www.twincitiescarry.com/forum/vi ... php?t=4060
says that if you DO NOT have a permit to carry, your firearm must be unloaded and encased.

Minnesota statute 624.714 Subd. 9.
A permit to carry is not required of a person:

(1) to keep or carry about the person's place of business, dwelling house, premises or on land possessed by the person a pistol;

(2) to carry a pistol from a place of purchase to the person's dwelling house or place of business, or from the person's dwelling house or place of business to or from a place where repairing is done, to have the pistol repaired;

(3) to carry a pistol between the person's dwelling house and place of business;


The above is from www.leg.state.mn.us/
The question that comes to mind is if the rule for encasement and unloaded is for general transportation of a firearm while the latter is more specific?

Just talked to a lady and the Ramsey County Sheriffs Department and she said that to carry on your person is to have it concealed, even if it is un-covered and able to be seen.
I asked if there was a difference between permits to Open Carry and Conceal and Carry and she said no...if it is on your person you have to have a CC permit.
I asked her about subdivision 9 and she said that a permit is required even though that statute states that a permit is NOT required?!?!

And just to reiterate this...I AM taking the conceal carry course soon. Also, I DO NOT carry between my business and home, it is in an enclosed case in the trunk.

A lot of this will become clear when you take your class, if you take it from a competent instructor.

In brief, there's no such thing as a "concealed carry permit" in Minnesota. It's a carry permit.

Subd. 9 is a specific exception to the general prohibition on carrying a firearm in a public place. The Ramsey County person gave you incorrect information. That's not surprising; the sheriff there is vehemently anti-carry and abuses his authority in order to hassle permit holders and other gun owners.

Asking a cop about the law is like asking a butcher about brain surgery.

http://www.gunthorp.com/Relevant%20MN%20Statutes.htm


Link above should take you to a bunch of laws-- Check out MN 624.714

Could not find the federal firearm laws as I am at work and we have a firewall that does not like guns--

Not sure if your ? pertains to carrying at home or a firearm in your vehicle-- The laws above should have your answers


(b) to carry a pistol from a place of purchase to the person's dwelling house or place of business, or from the person's dwelling house or place of business to or from a place where repairing is done, to have the pistol repaired;

(c) to carry a pistol between the person's dwelling house and place of business;

(d) to carry a pistol in the woods or fields or upon the waters of this state for the purpose of hunting or of target shooting in a safe area; or

(e) to transport a pistol in a motor vehicle, snowmobile or boat if the pistol is unloaded, contained in a closed and fastened case, gunbox, or securely tied package.

Carry Laws and Permitting Details for $2000!

Alex Trebeck:
The personification of someone who should never be relied upon for anything even aproaching the most miniscule form of legal advice.

Contestant:
Who is "a lady and the Ramsey County Sheriffs Department "!



Welcome aboard sachmn. Good to have you on here. I hope you find yourself placed for enrollment in one of the fine reputable instructors classes here on this board. You will learn so much valuable information, and will feel empowered as one who carries with pure knowlege.

Until (and after that), please do your best to disregard everything that lady told you. Joel may even charge you an "Unlearning Fee" if you bring that "knowledge" to his class!

First of all.. the standard disclaimer: IANAL

Second... neither is this lady you spoke to at the Ramsey County Sheriffs Department.

My interpretation is this.. carry is carry.. your permit to carry allows you to carry concealed or open. It makes no distinction. Subd. 1a. says that a permit is required to carry in public places or in a motor vehicle. 624.7181 Subd. 1c. defines what is meant by a "public place".

Subd 9
1) to keep or carry..
2) to carry..
3) to carry..
4) to carry..

However, how many of you don't use a motor vehicle to get to a gun repair shop or your place of business?And does place of business mean you're the owner of this business, or is it good enough to just be an employee? Being mindful that most business have policy regarding employees carrying while on the job

...I don't want to be the test case...

also

Subd 9 really doesn't lift that many restrictions. Carrying to your "place of business" or a "repair shop" NOT in a motor vehicle is pretty restrictive.

Wow, I appreciate all the responses. First off, I'm not sure what IANAL means.
I kind of figured she either did not know what she was talking about and/or just gave me the information out of "maybe we should just keep this guy from carrying a gun".
To be honest, I wouldn't choose to be the test case, but at the same time it seems that subdivision 9 clears up the fact that I CAN as a business OWNER registered with the state carry a gun between my home and my business(like I said, I do not though).
One would think, and hope, that if questioned about it by law enforcement I could hand over my license with my squeeky clean criminal record as well as my permit to purchase(showing that I have had a state background check and passed) would be enough to get off with a slap on the wrist or a firm warning on what could happen(at most).
Though I do not carry while in the car, I do carry proof that I own a business and a copy of this statute in the case that I decide to carry on my way to or from work.
Again, I appreciate the feedback and I'm looking forward to being more active on the site than I have in the past.

IANAL = I Am Not A Lawyer

Gee thanks! You owe me a keyboard cleaning!

That was freakin' funny!

Yup; it's also true.

More generally . . . since the original poster haven't taken his carry class yet, this isn't aimed at him. . .

Around here, we occasionally see somebody who has taken a good class from a good instructor and still has a question or two about issues around carry that they didn't quite get in class. (I can't remember many that aren't covered in the book, but I'm sure that there have been a few.) There's a fair amount of stuff that's important to know, and sometimes it can slip by. That's fine.

Much more frequently, we see new folks posting who have taken a perhaps less than stellar class from a less than stellar instructor, who skimped on important issues, either because they don't quite get them, or because they were more concerned with other matters. Many instructors -- both good and bad ones -- spend a fair amount of time in class telling stories. That's a good thing when the stories are used to illustrate and teach -- or even, occasionally, to give a bit of comic or other relief. There's a lot to cover, and a few breaks of several sorts are good things.

On the other hand, there are instructors who have heard of or seen one of those instructors who are good at using that as a teaching tool, but aren't up to it, and spend hours telling pointless stories that just pad out the minimal or subminimal stuff that they are going to cover.

So, as Andrew said: this is the sort of thing that will be handled in a good class. And if somebody takes a substandard class and uses the Forum to try to fill in the blank spaces that they know are missing, that will probably work -- for the blank spaces that they know they missed.

Thanks Hunter07!

I try.

To be fair, Andrew, cops know the laws the people break routinely pretty well.

Asking a cop about the MCPPA is like asking a cook at McD's the best way to cook that filet mignon.

We're aware that it exists, but we don't deal with it regularly, and so don't know the details. That's actually a good thing, isn't it? It means that cops generally have had no need to know the specifics of the law. Good on ALL of ya!

That is a much better analogy. I plan on stealing it.

I'll just add that asking a metro police clerk about your gun rights is like Little Red Riding Hood asking the Big Bad Wolf for the safest path through the forest.

Thanks for this post, tman065. Some of us need this kind of perspective on a regular basis.

A good point -- so good, in fact, that I've made it over the years.

That said, with something like 60,000 people in MN able to do something lawfully that would be a crime otherwise, and given that the basics of the carry law, from a cop POV, really are pretty simple, I think that six years after the MCPPA passing, it's not unreasonable to expect departments to get their folks up to speed on the carry laws by now. From a cop perspective, there's really only about five minutes' worth of information that needs to be absorbed -- and if it's abridged to "don't worry about the permit holders carrying guns at all; that's legal, and okay", it wouldn't be far off.

When it gets to those few badged folks who regularly deal with permit holder issues -- say, the deputies who deal with issuance -- I think that spending two, three hours learning about the stuff isn't too much to ask.