Apparentaly their is only one way to skin a cat, I have always believed that the path to success is wide and comes in many shades and colors. I found nothing disrespectful an any manner in pinnacles posts. Something smells rotten in Denmark. As far as the change in tone here, I agree.........

I suppose people feel anonomous on the internet. An some people use he internet to escape other problems in life, and are not at their best when they post. Sort of like aggressive drivers, (or passive-aggessive drivers who just like to bug somebody without making eye contact.)

But I am puzzled. Real smart people getting angry at their friends over some incident that does not affect them personally.

And police officers, who must usually be pretty strong emotionally, essentially taking their ball and going home in a pout, because of an amatuer criticism of somebody they don't even know.

How does this happen? Do we have a psycologist to explain?

Differing opinions aren't only welcome here, but utterly common. That said, folks who put forward opinions certainly should not be surprised if others' differ with their opinions, although some certainly appear to be shocked when that happens.

And, yeah, there's been some button pushing going on; a couple of folks seem to be curious to see exactly how close they can get to be rule-zeroed without actually being rule-zeroed.

Some years ago, I was at a party my late friend Bob Adams was hosting at a convention in Louisiana; one local writer, Elaine Radford, and her boyfriend showed up with the apparent intent to see how far they could push Bob's famous hospitality without being asked to leave, making comments (not particularly gracious ones) about the quality of the booze (it was, in my opinion, quite good -- Bob had gone to some trouble with that as usual), Bob's military service (he had been seriously wounded in Korea, when he stepped on a mine), etc.

Eventually the guy tried to pick a fight with Bob -- I do remember the girlfriend, Elaine Radford (I don't remember the guy's last name -- Roger something) saying, "you can't hit him; he's a pacifist" -- was asked to leave, and left.

That, of course, was not the story that they told, years later; see http://www.jerrypournelle.com/archives2 ... html#Adams

I've been watching this whole thing develop and I really am at a loss to determine who's at fault and who is letting their temper get the best of them.

Probably best to remain nuetral...

Well, I'm certainly not neutral. I understand it that a few Forum members feel -- quite possibly accurately -- that they could do a better job of running the Forum than I have been.

I think they're probably right.

Which is why I've been encouraging them -- as Ace knows; we just PMed on the subject today -- to start a PHPBB forum that's more to their taste. (I hadn't been aware, until earlier, that Ace has major sysadmin credits; that only makes it better.)

That doesn't mean that somebody who would participate in their forum would be unable to participate here; it would just give them an opportunity to run things as they see fit, and if it turns out that some folks would prefer to participate there rather than here, rather than in addition, that'd be fine.

I'm hoping that I'll shortly be able to share the good news that,.perhaps, Ace and Pinnacle and Brit and Pat have decided to start another PHPBB forum, and promise to link to it from here, at least twice, to help them get it off the ground.

(For anybody else who is interested, it's not difficult, and not expensive; go to http://dreamhost.com, buy a domain name, and sign up for a basic account. A one-click install, and you're off...)

If playing the antagonist, "makes me giggle like a schoolgirl"ahhhhh reaching, can be fun though.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MXgJThe_kpE

If sniping from the weeds and asking questions pertinant to the topic being discussed, is pushing it?

I have to read through your cryptic monologues that are your answers, could I ask, that if it's one of my questions, a real short direct answer would suffice, instead of some reference to pachyderms. Thats just me.

It is interesting if you
your own screen name...........how bizarre.

I enjoy the information shared within these pages, playground antics of who said what to who when or where or why has really gotten old hat. Thats just me I guess.

I was REALLY worried where that video was going to point

I like the information posted here too.

You must admit that you've had a part in the interpersonal drama though.

I hope very plainly that amends can be made, that feelings will calm down and a general return to etiquette and Civility can happen.


I like BOTH side of the issue, We need to hear both sides of the story, We learn from BOTH sides.

Pinnacle, I wish you well and hope you return soon,

Joel, I enjoy your insiders view and hope that you can see it within you to take him back with open arms when he feels like it.

We all need to hear all sides, it is what makes up the difference between thinking men and ideologues.

Around minute 2 Mike Myers as Dieter says "I'm as happy as a little girl"

As I stated above, antagonist and sniping from the weeds, asking questions.
The interpersonal drama started on a Tuesday night/Wednesday morning and I had NO part in that.

Once I saw the Sprokets I remembered. I meant before I clicked the link

Sure. Just as, I'm sure, such things were fun for Ezra Buck.Well, yes, it is. It's not the asking questions part -- although the "have you stopped beating your wife" sort of questions do get old pretty quickly -- it's the "sniping from the weeds" part. To quote from the rules:
Please stop both; for various reasons, I'm increasingly impatient with your antics, and while I'm loathe to lock people out -- other than that sockpuppet (who, through an amazing coincidence, used the same IP address as one fellow who is now on a voluntary vacation, who logged on last night to call me a "kapo") I haven't locked somebody out involuntarily since John M. Erickson's latest recrudescence -- the Forum is quickly becoming no fun at all for me, and I'm increasingly tempted to shut it down for a while to give myself a break from the sniping from the weeds.

Bad idea to make the party unfun for the host; he always does have the option to say, "well, it's been lovely, but it's time to go home now."

That said, you can always find another party.

Speaking as "just a guy" who doesn't have a stake in this argument, this whole discussion leaves me with a bad taste in my mouth. Something like drinking a cup of coffee at a Denny's.

In the immortal words of Jed Clampett, "Pitiful. Jest pitiful."

I agree, and while, as I said, I'm getting more than a little weary of the "sniping from the weeds", it's worth remembering that Pinnacle's taken a vacation -- with an additional curtain call -- by his decision, not because he's been uninvited to the party.

[ETA: that, of course, has changed. Shapero, for reasons that I'm sure he felt compelling, pushed things further; his curtain call is now permanent, and probably should have been made permanent earlier. I'm kinda slow on some things.]

As to me having an insider's view, I dunno about that. I've got a fair number of contacts in various places, sure, but getting information on a lot of issues isn't like pulling teeth -- people walk into a dentist's office voluntarily, after all.