I'm looking at picking up a Glock 29, Glock's 10mm compact.

But I'm worried I won't like it -- my other 10mm guns are S&W 1006 and 1066 which are big, stainless steel lumps that absorb a ton of recoil.

I'd rent one at Bills, but they only have a 20, which is a much larger gun and probably not indicitive of the 29's feel.

So I want to shoot yours, obviously with you present and whatever your choice of ammo would be (which hopefully would be one of the full power 10mm factory loadings, and not the Federal FBI lite loadings).

Your range time, targets and ammo (within reason) would be free, as well as use of my S&W 10mm pistols with factory ammo or my handloads.

What ammo are you using in your 10?

I finally got a Dan Wesson 10mm and will be ordering 500 rounds of Double Tap's 180 gold dot load end of this month.

Plan to use that as my main load.

All handloads right now, which consists of:

Starline nickel plated cases
Remington 180gr FMJ flat-point or 180gr JHP
Winchester Large Pistol primers
8.0 grains Power Pistol
loaded on a Dillon Square Deal B press

This feels like a pretty stout load, and depending on how you read the Alliant reloading data it can be seen as "kind of hot" or "not really." There's no 180gr FMJ FP load listed; 8.2gr for a 190gr JFP, and 8.7gr for 180gr JHP.

I'm not sure I get the discrepency, as the two slugs are within 5% of mass and probably have very similar case contact areas. There's not much to compare it with other than the ultra-hot loads listed on places like Glocktalk or 10mmtalk where people seem to be loading as much as 9 grains Power Pistol with plated bullets, which I wouldn't touch, except with a bolt action rifle.

I've used Blue Dot and Unique before in 10mm. I think Unique might actually be a decent carry powder as there's little muzzle flash. PowerPistol and Blue Dot have a fair amount of flash, but I think PP or BD will give the better ballistics.

I've shot a few boxes of factory ammo from Remington, PMC, Federal American Eagle, Hornady, and some Georgia Arms factory reloads & their "+P Gold Dot" new ammo.

Federal was the weakest, but their ballistics tables reveal it. Remington, PMC, & Georgia Arms factory reloads were similar. The Georgia Arms "+P" is pretty weak, and I think I'll unload it and reload it with Power Pistol (plus its misleading; I don't think there is any SAAMI spec for 10mm +P). My handloads and the Hornady were very similar, although I think the Hornady is a tad warmer.

Haven't shot any Double Tap; I'm adverse to paying for ammo when I can (re)load it myself for as little as $0.11 a round, plus DT is way hot and I don't see a percentage in smashing my pistols on a regular basis with megapower ammo.

Long term I'd like to come up with a duplicate load of the Winchester Silvertip 10mm loading. Good (without being volcanic) ballistics, and you can buy Silvertips for handloading, enabling cheap practice+carry ammo.

Where did you get the DW 10mm? Gunstop has at least one that's been there for a while, but they said they like the Kimber 10mm better. A 1911 pattern 10mm for more target-type shooting is on my short list.

[OBLIGATORY WARNING: ALL HANDLOADS WORK WELL IN *MY* GUNS AND WHEN LOADED ON *MY* PRESS. YOUR MILEAGE *WILL* VARY. DO NOT USE OR COPY THIS LOAD WITHOUT EXPERIENCE AND REFERENCE TO MODERN LOADING MANUALS, EQUIPMENT & SUPPLIES AND YOUR GUN MAKER'S ADVICE ON AMMUNITION SELECTION.]

I got my Dan Wesson from H&H in Maple Lake. Little town west of the cities on Hwy 55. They can't get Kimbers because they are to small of a shop.

And they were about $75.00 cheaper than anyone I could find in the Metro (Bills, Sportsman Warehouse, etc).

They usually stock one or two of the DW and usually have an EAA 10mm around also. Seems to be a small group of 10mm fans around here, probably because it is legal for deer.

Curious about why you think DT ammo is way hot?

Mike said they are within SAAMI standards. For the 180 grain load the claimed MV is only 5 fps more than Max load for Blue Dot shown in Speer #12 Reloading Manual.

Buffalo Bore loads same bullet, and they claim 50 fps more (1350 vs 1300 for DT).

As for handloading it just isn't a practical option with my current living situation. I don't have any space were I can leave stuff set up.

So I have been buying ammo by the case. Not to mention I will probably never be motivated enough to chases after the brass from automatics ever again.

When I was in High School my uncle got a Colt Delta in 10mm, the first handgun I ever shot, and no matter how hard I tried was always losing brass. Ammo was expensive for 10mm then and my uncle would give me a lot of grief over the lost brass

I plan to reload for my revolvers and at least one rifle eventually. But for now the plan is to keep enough ammo around for my CCW and HD (home defense) guns so I can practice at least once a week with them without feeling like I am running out of ammo.

As to wearing out guns, I hope to get to the point were I wear one out every 5 years or so. Not sure I will ever wear a gun out, but I am trying! Many of the people I whose shooting skill I really respect have worn out guns.

IMHO Bill's prices are sky high, but that's probably another thread.

It's not that it's dangerously overpressure, it's just loaded to the outer limits of the pressure spec. Which I guess is appropriate for a hunting load or some special purpose, but if you want to practice frequently with your carry load I think is just excessive wear and tear on a gun. You could mitigate it with heavier springs and maybe a recoil buffer (and there are lot of 10mm fans that do this so they can shoot real heavy loads).


I don't mind chasing down brass -- it's like chasing down dimes, literally! When I can I like to make trips to the range when I think it will be reasonably quiet and I can get The Lane That Makes It Easier To Find Your Brass.

But I hear you about a dedicated space. I was orignally planning to set my press up in my office/computer room, but I'm glad I did it in the garage instead. I've of course spilled powder, tumbling media, and the primer decap cup for my press could have been designed a little better -- I get spent primers on the floor more often than I'd like. All that would have been a huge problem in the house.

I've got my press screwed to my workbench, which has been OK since I haven't pursued many wood projects of late, but I think I will build a rig so that I can anchor it to the workbench when I want to use it, but make the base removable and build a hard cover for it if I need to use the space for something else.

Thus far it's made 10mm shooting affordable. I can live with $125/case 10mm ammo, store bought would be over the top. Downside is that I shoot less 45 auto (which I also reload), since a day at the range without 10mm is like a day without sunshine.

As to finding brass. I do almost all of my shooting outdoors. I live about 45 minutes West of the Twin Cities.

The range I belong to is less than ten minutes away but it is outdoors (actually I prefer outdoors, muzzleblast is less of a problem) and with care I can do a bit of shooting on the Hobby Farm I live on.

Trust me chasing brass from a 1911 in even short grass is a challenge for little kids and near impossible for adults.

I have a buddy that has kids, he shoots a lot at his brothers farm. After shooting is over the kids are turned lose to find brass whoever finds the most gets a prize. And Dad gets most of his brass back without having to do a grid search.

I know I could put a tarp or something down, but then your stuck shooting over the tarp and it still takes time to set up secure enough so it doesn't blow away.

I'd rather spend that time on other stuff. I am working on putting movement in with my shooting.

Planning to get a helium tank (Wal Mart offers small tanks for sale), several anchor weights and balloons to have "moving" targets. Also plan to get plastic barrels, weighted boxes, or plywood sections (if I can figure a cheap stand) to use for cover for both me and the targets.

As long as I don't do anything unsafe and their aren't other people at the range I'm using I think I can figure out ways to add a lot more difficulty to my shooting practice than a normal paper only range.

Figure an anchored helium balloon about cheapest portable target I can come up with.

The helium baloon idea is quite clever.

I wonder if you could string a thin cable between barrels at a slight incline with the baloon secured to a small ring or washer on the cable. Presumably the incline woud allow the baloon to rise along the incline simulating a moving target. I wonder if you'd have to weight it, though, and have it move down the incline instead to get any reasonable velocity.

Arrangement of the endpoints could make this movement sideways, to you, away from you, etc. You'd need a release of some kind, you could either make it hand-activated (rope or something) or by knocking over a weighted target making the whole thing reactionary.

Might be fun (if tedious) to fill the balloons with baking soda or talcum powder, too.

It'd be fun to have an open outdoor shooting area.

Having shot your 10mm -- and my own, which is still at the gunsmith, awaiting a minor repair -- I'd have to agree that it's a, err, blast.

Felt kind of bad scaring the students those two days, but I guess they have to get used to the noise eventually.

Which one do you own?

It shouldn't be to hard to set up pairs of ballons so when one is shot another pops up or down.

Other thing I thought of is putting a grocery bag, paper or plastic, over helium filled balloon. For shotgun exerciese, that way it should be easy to tell how many pellets actually hit.