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 It May Be Time 
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 01, 2006 12:20 pm 
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Thanks Andrew. In one police shooting interview by internal affairs, an officer was asked why he fired 27 rounds. He replied "That's all I had." I suspect the avg no. rds fired by CCW's will be less than police figures. That would make for an interesting study. Perhaps you know of some. I would hope that serious CCW's will have a better placement and hit ratio than LE and the BG's. It would be hard to find a better fight stopper than five well placed 215 gr HP's from the .41 Mag.


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 Post subject: Re: It May Be Time
PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 9:53 am 
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gunflint wrote:
I started with handguns when I got my permit in march of 04. I've owned long guns since childhood. My current carry gun is the first sidearm I ever owned. It'a .41 magnum Taurus revolver in titanium. I like the gun and am comfortable carrying it.

But lately I'm having thoughts of trading it in for a 10mm semi auto. Is this a smart move? Or is my mind telling me to start shopping for a gun, It's like an addiction.

I believe that the 10mm will handel most situations that the .41 does, and carries alot more ammo. Who makes a good 10mm? Thanks


Wow, how did I miss *this* thread?

Power-wise, other posters are right -- .41 Mag packs a meaningful increase in power over the 10mm. Winchester lists a .41 Mag 240gr load @ 833 ft/lbs @ 1250 ft/sec. Closest you can come in 10mm are a couple of DoubleTap loadings with about 700 ft lbs @ 1250 ft/sec. Some guys on the 10mm forums seem to be producing loads approaching 800 ft/lbs of energy, but those are risking ka-booms IMHO.

The question is whether 700 ft/lbs is enough oomph; I think it probably is for everything but a super-pissed off bear or a moose, and with those two I'd think that anything less than a rifle wouldn't really cut it.

As for your 10mm choices...

S&W 1000 series: These haven't been made for a while, but they're built like tanks, all stainless steel, and can handle the the original Norma 10mm loading. I have the 1006 and the 1066; the 1006 is a 5" and the 1066 is a 4". Both are traditional DA/SA with decocking safeties. The 1006 is too big for reasonable concealment, the 1066 isn't that much smaller but works if you're a big guy. Both hold 9+1. The 1066 is hard to find but the 1006 should be something you could track down in good condition.

S&W also made a revolver in 10mm, the 610. This is on my buy list if I see one in good condition, especially a 6.5" barrel model. Apparently popular with a few people because they can be reamed out to shoot 10mm magnum (1200 ft/lbs @ 1700 ft/sec!).

Glocks: The 20 (full size) and 29 are both really great guns. I have the 29 and use it as a carry gun. Very concealable and surpisingly easy to shoot, especially with a Pearce grip extension. The G29 holds 10+1 and can take the 15 round G20 mags; a grip extension for the G20 mags simulates a longer grip and easier shooting, but it's a little "wiggly" for my taste, but 15+1 in 10mm is tough to beat.

1911s: I have a Kimber Stainless Target II which has been a great gun for me. It's run perfect out of the box, and I'll admit being surprised given the fair amount of noise about Kimbers you read here and there. Kimber make another model (the Eclipse, I think) in 10mm as well. Dan Wesson/CZ make two , a full size and a commander size. They seem to be well thought of, but I liked the Kimber best when I bought mine. The commander sized model is appealing to me, but more so just to have a commander-sized 10mm; not sure that I would carry it. I like my Kimber enough that I'm thinking getting the same model in 38 Super.

EAA Witness (made by Tangfolio) : Never shot one, but I've handled them. Word is that they're OK shooters, but can be rough out of the box and needing a little light handwork to get them to run reliably. One of the more inexpensive options.

Reloads: I only shoot reloads; 10mm is too expensive and the ammo too hard to find to shoot just factory ammo. Reloading (both the process and the finished product) has some inherent risk, but if done properly reloaded ammo is more consistent and accurate than factory ammo and poses no risk to you or your gun. With 10mm you have to watch for split cases; due to high pressures the cases will eventually wear out. I've put about 3-4000 reloads through my 10mm guns with no problems.

Glocks are a special case with reloads; Glock's factory barrels have poor case support at the "6 o'clock" position on the chamber, as well as having loose chambers. The greater amount of expansion in a Glock chamber coupled with the slight weakening of the brass through the re-sizing phase of reloading can lead to case failure and ka-booms. To avoid this, you can put an aftermarket barrel in your Glock. I have a KKM in my G29 -- better case support and a tighter chamber means I don't have to worry so much about case failure, and as a side benefit the barrel is a lot more accurate.

I'd say you could probably replace your .41 Mag with a G29, but given that you wouldn't get a whole lot for your Taurus, I'd just buy a G29 and have an additional gun. The .41 Mag is probably a better choice on bears, but the G29 will conceal better and can probably handle most of what passes for dangerous animals in MN.


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 Post subject: 458
PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 10:09 am 
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Im waiting for them to make a 458 win mag handgun. I have a 458 win-mag in a long gun. :shock:

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 Post subject: Re: 458
PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 10:17 am 
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lastgunshop wrote:
Im waiting for them to make a 458 win mag handgun. I have a 458 win-mag in a long gun. :shock:


Let's hope they reverse-stamp "I WAS SHOOTING A POWERFUL HANDGUN" on the top of the barrel, so when it smashes you in the face and knocks you out, the people that find you can read your forehead and know what happened...


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 Post subject: Re: 458
PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 10:23 am 
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mobocracy wrote:
lastgunshop wrote:
Im waiting for them to make a 458 win mag handgun. I have a 458 win-mag in a long gun. :shock:


Let's hope they reverse-stamp "I WAS SHOOTING A POWERFUL HANDGUN" on the top of the barrel, so when it smashes you in the face and knocks you out, the people that find you can read your forehead and know what happened...
People have told me that I have a thick head. :)

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 10:32 am 
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Location: Phillips Neighborhood Minneapolis
Just let me know when and where you're going to shoot it. I'll bring my camcorder.


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 Post subject: Re: 458
PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 10:50 pm 
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lastgunshop wrote:
Im waiting for them to make a 458 win mag handgun.


Pfeifer Waffen makes one, but you would have a hell of a time getting it imported.


http://www.pfeifer-waffen.at/cms/html/i ... ewlang=eng


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