Twin Cities Carry Forum Archive :: View topic - Race Gun

someone1980 wrote:

Glock + iPod sent me the following link (I don't know why he didn't post it)
http://news.asianweek.com/news/view_art ... e483560d9e

It talks about Vera Koo who is a very good competitive shooter. They mention that she shoots a 38 super. So I did a little digging and it sounds like a hopped up 9mm that makes major.

So that got me to thinking about my own IDPA experience. I shoot a 5" 9mm XD. The muzzle flip isn't too bad, and as I have exercised my shooting muscles it has lessened a good deal. But I see these people shooting IPSC race guns and it doesn't look like there is any muzzle flip.

So I guess I am wondering is how much of that control is the cartriage, reloaded ammo, compensator, full metal pistol, and muscle. Can a 21 year old female walk out for her first range trip and shoot a pistol that makes a bigger bang but doesn't increase the recoil?

I also have this facination with a red dot on a pistol... but would like to give it a shot before I start spending the big bucks.

someone1980 wrote:

a 38 super. So I did a little digging and it sounds like a hopped up 9mm that makes major.

Selurcspi wrote:

someone1980 wrote:

someone1980,

PM me and we can make arrangements to shoot, I'm a long time ipsc shooter and my race gun is similar to Vera's, you can check it out with 175pf loads and you'll see how light the recoil feels. I've seen 10 year olds competing with 38sup and they do just fine.

mo_the_mouse wrote:

Selurcspi wrote:

someone1980 wrote:

I have shot this 38sup. Take him up on it. FUN!!!

Selurcspi wrote:

Two of my typical loads are 145gr lrn at 1250fps or 135gr fmj at 1350fps. Both make the old major floor work well in my gun and are comfortable to shoot.
I know a few guys using 95gr fmj at about 1750fps, but their cases show waaaaaay too much pressure, primer flow, heavy imprinting, scary stuff. :shock:

Author:	someone1980 [ Thu Dec 14, 2006 11:23 pm ]
Post subject:	Race Gun - 38 super
Glock + iPod sent me the following link (I don't know why he didn't post it) http://news.asianweek.com/news/view_art ... e483560d9e It talks about Vera Koo who is a very good competitive shooter. They mention that she shoots a 38 super. So I did a little digging and it sounds like a hopped up 9mm that makes major. So that got me to thinking about my own IDPA experience. I shoot a 5" 9mm XD. The muzzle flip isn't too bad, and as I have exercised my shooting muscles it has lessened a good deal. But I see these people shooting IPSC race guns and it doesn't look like there is any muzzle flip. So I guess I am wondering is how much of that control is the cartriage, reloaded ammo, compensator, full metal pistol, and muscle. Can a 21 year old female walk out for her first range trip and shoot a pistol that makes a bigger bang but doesn't increase the recoil? I also have this facination with a red dot on a pistol... but would like to give it a shot before I start spending the big bucks.

Author:	doctor_strangelove [ Fri Dec 15, 2006 12:02 am ]
Post subject:
I looked at those Doktor red dot sights, as they're compact and very sturdy, apparently, but the price (~350-400$) on those things... "The pistols weigh approximately 5 lbs. when loaded with bullets." Maybe the weight might contribute to the ease of control, compared to your very lithe XD9...

Author:	cdl [ Fri Dec 15, 2006 12:14 am ]
Post subject:
Major at 175,000 in .45 was a light load. In 9mm it was explosive. At 165000 it’s even lighter in a .45 or 38 super. A comp and all that weight upfront virtually eliminates muzzle flip. All things being equal though, the faster 38 super got to the target first and that’s how you win.

Author:	Selurcspi [ Fri Dec 15, 2006 7:42 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Race Gun - 38 super
someone1980 wrote: Glock + iPod sent me the following link (I don't know why he didn't post it) http://news.asianweek.com/news/view_art ... e483560d9e It talks about Vera Koo who is a very good competitive shooter. They mention that she shoots a 38 super. So I did a little digging and it sounds like a hopped up 9mm that makes major. So that got me to thinking about my own IDPA experience. I shoot a 5" 9mm XD. The muzzle flip isn't too bad, and as I have exercised my shooting muscles it has lessened a good deal. But I see these people shooting IPSC race guns and it doesn't look like there is any muzzle flip. So I guess I am wondering is how much of that control is the cartriage, reloaded ammo, compensator, full metal pistol, and muscle. Can a 21 year old female walk out for her first range trip and shoot a pistol that makes a bigger bang but doesn't increase the recoil? I also have this facination with a red dot on a pistol... but would like to give it a shot before I start spending the big bucks. someone1980, PM me and we can make arrangements to shoot, I'm a long time ipsc shooter and my race gun is similar to Vera's, you can check it out with 175pf loads and you'll see how light the recoil feels. I've seen 10 year olds competing with 38sup and they do just fine.

Author:	DeanC [ Fri Dec 15, 2006 8:39 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Race Gun - 38 super
someone1980 wrote: a 38 super. So I did a little digging and it sounds like a hopped up 9mm that makes major. That's what it is and what it's used for. I'm a little jaundiced about which part of "Practical" it fulfills.

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Race Gun - 38 super http://ellegon.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=3550	Page 1 of 2

Author:	mo_the_mouse [ Fri Dec 15, 2006 10:01 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Race Gun - 38 super
Selurcspi wrote: someone1980 wrote: Glock + iPod sent me the following link (I don't know why he didn't post it) http://news.asianweek.com/news/view_art ... e483560d9e It talks about Vera Koo who is a very good competitive shooter. They mention that she shoots a 38 super. So I did a little digging and it sounds like a hopped up 9mm that makes major. So that got me to thinking about my own IDPA experience. I shoot a 5" 9mm XD. The muzzle flip isn't too bad, and as I have exercised my shooting muscles it has lessened a good deal. But I see these people shooting IPSC race guns and it doesn't look like there is any muzzle flip. So I guess I am wondering is how much of that control is the cartriage, reloaded ammo, compensator, full metal pistol, and muscle. Can a 21 year old female walk out for her first range trip and shoot a pistol that makes a bigger bang but doesn't increase the recoil? I also have this facination with a red dot on a pistol... but would like to give it a shot before I start spending the big bucks. someone1980, PM me and we can make arrangements to shoot, I'm a long time ipsc shooter and my race gun is similar to Vera's, you can check it out with 175pf loads and you'll see how light the recoil feels. I've seen 10 year olds competing with 38sup and they do just fine. I have shot this 38sup. Take him up on it. FUN!!!

Author:	Selurcspi [ Fri Dec 15, 2006 10:10 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Race Gun - 38 super
mo_the_mouse wrote: Selurcspi wrote: someone1980 wrote: Glock + iPod sent me the following link (I don't know why he didn't post it) http://news.asianweek.com/news/view_art ... e483560d9e It talks about Vera Koo who is a very good competitive shooter. They mention that she shoots a 38 super. So I did a little digging and it sounds like a hopped up 9mm that makes major. So that got me to thinking about my own IDPA experience. I shoot a 5" 9mm XD. The muzzle flip isn't too bad, and as I have exercised my shooting muscles it has lessened a good deal. But I see these people shooting IPSC race guns and it doesn't look like there is any muzzle flip. So I guess I am wondering is how much of that control is the cartriage, reloaded ammo, compensator, full metal pistol, and muscle. Can a 21 year old female walk out for her first range trip and shoot a pistol that makes a bigger bang but doesn't increase the recoil? I also have this facination with a red dot on a pistol... but would like to give it a shot before I start spending the big bucks. someone1980, PM me and we can make arrangements to shoot, I'm a long time ipsc shooter and my race gun is similar to Vera's, you can check it out with 175pf loads and you'll see how light the recoil feels. I've seen 10 year olds competing with 38sup and they do just fine. I have shot this 38sup. Take him up on it. FUN!!! Thanks for the vote of confidence Mo

Author:	mmcnx2 [ Fri Dec 15, 2006 3:03 pm ]
Post subject:	Race Gun
I also have a 38 super race gun. Mine was bulit by Brazo out of texas and is dream to shoot. It is not a practical gun to carry as most people would invision carry. But, it does what is was built for. The recoil, or lack of it, is really a combination of all the factors you mentioned. Also influenced by bullet and powder selection. I'm in the west burbs PM me and we can meet at St. Cloud or Bill's and you can send a few down range. One word of caution at Bill's it is very very loud. I went to the range at elk river a few weeks ago for their thursday night league and they stopped me two rounds into a course to ask what it was. They were cool and let me finish but the guy next to me said he could feel the concusion of the round.

Author:	someone1980 [ Fri Dec 15, 2006 4:17 pm ]
Post subject:
Interesting. So you don't get the recoil in the hands, but do get a blast off of the comp. You specifically mentioned Bill's which is indoor, do you get reflection of the concusson off of the ceiling? Is outdoor nicer for something like that? Hmm. You guys are starting to make me think and ask questions. I am getting excited.

Author:	pezhead [ Fri Dec 15, 2006 5:03 pm ]
Post subject:
I can see that the concussion from the muzzle brake may cause problems indoors. At Bill's fall show they had a .50 BMG & you could feel it through the floor. I did shoot off one round & it didn't kick that much but the shock wave is something else. It would be nice to have one though along with everything else on my wish list. Sounds like a nice gun.

Author:	mmcnx2 [ Tue Dec 19, 2006 8:20 am ]
Post subject:	Race Gun
Actually, outdoors is typically much more comfortable to shoot these type of guns, however with our current temp adn the short term future looking like it is going to get worse. we're forced to go indoors to get some trigger time. You get the pressure from the comp at the end of the barrel redircting the blast to the sides and down. The person next to you feels the pressure from the side blast. They are an engineering marvel to watch run and a darn good looking pistol. I'll be at Bill's on Dec 31 in the morning if you want to stop by.

Author:	Seismic Sam [ Tue Dec 19, 2006 8:30 pm ]
Post subject:	Okay
I have been trying to find a shooter for some time who will actually fess up and tell me how fast they load their 38 Super rounds. I'm assuming that you're using 9 x 23 brass, and I'm curious just how FAST you can push a 9mm bullet. You don't have to tell me what the load specs are, but if you can tell me how heavy the bullet is and how fast it's going, I would appreciate it. P.S. The top loads in one of my many handloading manuals lists the top end of 38 Super as 1550 with light bullets.

Author:	mmcnx2 [ Wed Dec 20, 2006 11:32 am ]
Post subject:	Super 38
Actually I use 38super +p brass. I prefer the remington nickel becuase it is easier to pick out from the 9mm stuff. I use a 125gr .356 bullet and am pushing it at 1350fps, using IMR 4765. I will warn you this is not something that should be done in a gun not specifically made for it, the load is HOT and will cause issues with a 'stock' 38 super gun. These loads need to be this way to make the comp work and make Major power factor. As always start with a load you know is safe and work your way up to what you need. If you see pressure signs, STOP IMMED, and back the load off. Making major with 9mm is a whole different game due to the casing size and powder/bullet options.

Author:	Selurcspi [ Wed Dec 20, 2006 11:52 am ]
Post subject:
Two of my typical loads are 145gr lrn at 1250fps or 135gr fmj at 1350fps. Both make the old major floor work well in my gun and are comfortable to shoot. I know a few guys using 95gr fmj at about 1750fps, but their cases show waaaaaay too much pressure, primer flow, heavy imprinting, scary stuff.

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Author:	Pinnacle [ Wed Dec 20, 2006 12:43 pm ]
Post subject:
Selurcspi wrote: Two of my typical loads are 145gr lrn at 1250fps or 135gr fmj at 1350fps. Both make the old major floor work well in my gun and are comfortable to shoot. I know a few guys using 95gr fmj at about 1750fps, but their cases show waaaaaay too much pressure, primer flow, heavy imprinting, scary stuff. Wow imagine that load in an unsupported chamber - can you say BLOW OUT. man that is FAST for a pistol... it is interesting that out of a G17 the Winchester RA9TA goes 1350fps FACTORY - now that is fast with a 127gr bullet - I am wondering if that makes Major as I do not know that much about IPSC and the power factor limits and seem to be unmotivated to look it up. That would make an itneresting option if it were to make Major.....