Index  •  FAQ  •  Search  

It is currently Fri Dec 04, 2020 9:16 pm

This is a static archive the Twin Cities Carry forum, maintained as a public service by the current forum of record, The Minnesota Carry Forum.

All times are UTC - 6 hours




Forum locked This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 51 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4  Next
 Complaining about Joel Over at Day Care 
Author Message
 Post subject: Complaining about Joel Over at Day Care
PostPosted: Tue Jun 16, 2009 11:39 am 
On permanent time out
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 08, 2009 11:44 am
Posts: 15
golly, opinions sure do vary from one gun forum to the next. i was just reading a thread in the "training" area of mnguntalk and noticed a heck of alot guys jumping all over Joel. so, are the instructors over on guntalk as good as here, or what? i'm still going to take my class with DonL, but just thought these differences of opinions from forum to forum were worth mentioning. have a nice day guys. i'll check back in a couple days. jw

_________________
[This 'new member' has previously trolled the Forum as, variously, "ein brera", "Ezra Buck," and "1911silver." He's now gone back to the day care site. For those who are interested, his postings come from IP addresses 208.87.234.180 and 67.159.44.138. JR]


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: looking for a quality carry permit instructor
PostPosted: Tue Jun 16, 2009 11:46 am 
The Man
User avatar

Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2005 5:43 am
Posts: 7970
Location: Minneapolis MN
Jonahwaters wrote:
so, are the instructors over on guntalk as good as here, or what?
Except for the overlap, I'd rather doubt it; there's a reason I refer to it as the day care site, after all.

_________________
Just a guy.


Offline
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: looking for a quality carry permit instructor
PostPosted: Tue Jun 16, 2009 11:54 am 
Senior Member
User avatar

Joined: Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:41 pm
Posts: 234
Location: Apple-Mount Farming-Ville
Jonahwaters wrote:
golly, opinions sure do vary from one gun forum to the next.


Opinions are like a-holes... theres plenty of both on the forums.

_________________
NRA Instructor (BP, PPITH, PPOTH, Shothell + Metallic Reloading, RSO)
Certified Glock Armorer

MNbasecamp.com - Minnesota Outdoors Community


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: looking for a quality carry permit instructor
PostPosted: Tue Jun 16, 2009 12:10 pm 
The Man
User avatar

Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2005 5:43 am
Posts: 7970
Location: Minneapolis MN
True. Facts, though, don't vary; I'm by nature fairly impatient with folks who don't get that while they do get to choose their own opinions, they don't get to choose their own facts.

Around here, that is. Joe Penaz is an embarrassment to protoplasm is an opinion -- one that, I think, I've come by fairly, but that's another issue. It's slander to say that Joe Penaz let one of his students point a gun at Joel's back isn't an opinion; it's counterfactual, as a: it isn't slander, and b: Joe Penaz, the embarrassment to protoplasm, did just that, in front of witnesses.

DonL was among the witnesses, by the way.

_________________
Just a guy.


Offline
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: looking for a quality carry permit instructor
PostPosted: Tue Jun 16, 2009 12:16 pm 
Senior Member
User avatar

Joined: Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:41 pm
Posts: 234
Location: Apple-Mount Farming-Ville
joelr wrote:
DonL was among the witnesses, by the way.


Yep, he shares the story often as an example.

_________________
NRA Instructor (BP, PPITH, PPOTH, Shothell + Metallic Reloading, RSO)
Certified Glock Armorer

MNbasecamp.com - Minnesota Outdoors Community


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: looking for a quality carry permit instructor
PostPosted: Tue Jun 16, 2009 12:34 pm 
On permanent time out
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 08, 2009 11:44 am
Posts: 15
joelr wrote:
True. Facts, though, don't vary; I'm by nature fairly impatient with folks who don't get that while they do get to choose their own opinions, they don't get to choose their own facts.

Around here, that is. Joe Penaz is an embarrassment to protoplasm is an opinion -- one that, I think, I've come by fairly, but that's another issue. It's slander to say that Joe Penaz let one of his students point a gun at Joel's back isn't an opinion; it's counterfactual, as a: it isn't slander, and b: Joe Penaz, the embarrassment to protoplasm, did just that, in front of witnesses.

DonL was among the witnesses, by the way.


Joel, 19 different posters on guntalk responded to your thread negatively. is it possiblr they are all students of Penaz? wow, i almost couldn't believe all the trash talk about you. do you really block ip addresses so some guys can't come here to learn on your forum?

_________________
[This 'new member' has previously trolled the Forum as, variously, "ein brera", "Ezra Buck," and "1911silver." He's now gone back to the day care site. For those who are interested, his postings come from IP addresses 208.87.234.180 and 67.159.44.138. JR]


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: looking for a quality carry permit instructor
PostPosted: Tue Jun 16, 2009 12:52 pm 
Longtime Regular
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2008 9:40 pm
Posts: 2264
Location: Eden Prairie
Jonahwaters wrote:
golly, opinions sure do vary from one gun forum to the next. i was just reading a thread in the "training" area of mnguntalk and noticed a heck of alot guys jumping all over Joel. so, are the instructors over on guntalk as good as here, or what? i'm still going to take my class with DonL, but just thought these differences of opinions from forum to forum were worth mentioning. have a nice day guys. i'll check back in a couple days. jw


There's a bit of historical animosity there...lots of background.

But bluntly, if anyone's actually criticizing Joel as an instructor (as opposed to criticizing the forum), I'll loudly call bullshit on them.

Tell ya what...

You're going to be getting a top-notch class from Don, no question about it. I doubt you'd find anybody on either forum who would criticize him as an instructor or as a shooter. When you get a break during the class, why not ask him who else he'd recommend for instruction?

-Mark


Offline
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: looking for a quality carry permit instructor
PostPosted: Tue Jun 16, 2009 12:52 pm 
The Man
User avatar

Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2005 5:43 am
Posts: 7970
Location: Minneapolis MN
Jonahwaters wrote:
joelr wrote:
True. Facts, though, don't vary; I'm by nature fairly impatient with folks who don't get that while they do get to choose their own opinions, they don't get to choose their own facts.

Around here, that is. Joe Penaz is an embarrassment to protoplasm is an opinion -- one that, I think, I've come by fairly, but that's another issue. It's slander to say that Joe Penaz let one of his students point a gun at Joel's back isn't an opinion; it's counterfactual, as a: it isn't slander, and b: Joe Penaz, the embarrassment to protoplasm, did just that, in front of witnesses.

DonL was among the witnesses, by the way.


Joel, 19 different posters on guntalk responded to your thread negatively.
Is that all? Sheesh; some of them must be on a break.
Quote:
is it possiblr they are all students of Penaz?
Vanishingly unlikely. To be a little ungenerous, I doubt that most of Penaz's students can read. The only one I can recall here who got the boot was Magnum Mikie, and he worked real, real hard to get it. 1911fan is, if one of his buddies got it right, apparently a friend of the Penaz family, but I don't know who he took his carry class with.
Quote:
wow, i almost couldn't believe all the trash talk about you.
My guess is that most if it is unbelievable, all in all. Probably best kept over there, where it doesn't matter.
Quote:
do you really block ip addresses
You bet.
Quote:
so some guys can't come here to learn on your forum?
Nope. The folks who want to come here to learn are welcome; the IP block list, like the ban list (and like the names of the people whose usernames are on the ban list; see the rules), is no particular secret, and if you're curious and some admin wants to share it with you, they certainly can. In my opinion, all of the fairly short list of folks who have been rule zeroed out of here -- around eighteen people (only about ten who were ever active) and about two dozen accounts, over two almost four years -- have deserved it, but others can disagree. That's okay.

_________________
Just a guy.


Offline
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: looking for a quality carry permit instructor
PostPosted: Tue Jun 16, 2009 12:55 pm 
Longtime Regular
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2008 9:40 pm
Posts: 2264
Location: Eden Prairie
Jonahwaters wrote:
joelr wrote:
True. Facts, though, don't vary; I'm by nature fairly impatient with folks who don't get that while they do get to choose their own opinions, they don't get to choose their own facts.

Around here, that is. Joe Penaz is an embarrassment to protoplasm is an opinion -- one that, I think, I've come by fairly, but that's another issue. It's slander to say that Joe Penaz let one of his students point a gun at Joel's back isn't an opinion; it's counterfactual, as a: it isn't slander, and b: Joe Penaz, the embarrassment to protoplasm, did just that, in front of witnesses.

DonL was among the witnesses, by the way.


Joel, 19 different posters on guntalk responded to your thread negatively. is it possiblr they are all students of Penaz? wow, i almost couldn't believe all the trash talk about you. do you really block ip addresses so some guys can't come here to learn on your forum?


(ADMIN HAT ON)

I'll take this. The ban list here at TCC is very, very small, regardless of what a few people say. The list of people who Joel has actually Rule Zeroed is even smaller. It's funny how many people claim to have been kicked out for just disagreeing with Joel. Hell, if that was true half of the mods and admins around here would be gone.

If you're banned from here, it isn't for taking a class from a specific instructor, and it isn't for disagreeing with Joel. It's usually for a cranial - rectal inversion.

(ADMIN HAT OFF)

-Mark


Offline
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: looking for a quality carry permit instructor
PostPosted: Tue Jun 16, 2009 1:04 pm 
The Man
User avatar

Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2005 5:43 am
Posts: 7970
Location: Minneapolis MN
mrokern wrote:
I'll take this. The ban list here at TCC is very, very small, regardless of what a few people say. The list of people who Joel has actually Rule Zeroed is even smaller. It's funny how many people claim to have been kicked out for just disagreeing with Joel. Hell, if that was true half of the mods and admins around here would be gone.
Well, yeah, but so would the other half, too, I think.

_________________
Just a guy.


Offline
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: looking for a quality carry permit instructor
PostPosted: Tue Jun 16, 2009 1:11 pm 
On permanent time out
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 08, 2009 11:44 am
Posts: 15
thanks guys. i can hardly wait to take my class. and yes i'll ask DonL who he thinks are instructors worth taking classes from. Joel, i do really wonder why you bother advertising on guntalk. seems they don't like you over there. i'm hesitant about joining guntalk because of the conflicting discussions.

_________________
[This 'new member' has previously trolled the Forum as, variously, "ein brera", "Ezra Buck," and "1911silver." He's now gone back to the day care site. For those who are interested, his postings come from IP addresses 208.87.234.180 and 67.159.44.138. JR]


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: looking for a quality carry permit instructor
PostPosted: Tue Jun 16, 2009 1:16 pm 
Longtime Regular
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2008 9:40 pm
Posts: 2264
Location: Eden Prairie
Jonahwaters wrote:
thanks guys. i can hardly wait to take my class. and yes i'll ask DonL who he thinks are instructors worth taking classes from. Joel, i do really wonder why you bother advertising on guntalk. seems they don't like you over there. i'm hesitant about joining guntalk because of the conflicting discussions.


I'd join, if for no other reason than there are events posted on one forum that don't always make it onto the other and you won't be able to see a lot without a user name. I've got a membership, but I think I've only got a couple posts.

I come down very firmly into one of the camps in this argument, but it doesn't mean that there aren't good people on the other side too.

-Mark

ETA - You'll find that there tends to be more sport shooting and "gun guy" talk over there at times, while the political activist stuff is usually here. Each forum gets a good amount of the other, but there are definitely some...specialities, shall we say.


Offline
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: looking for a quality carry permit instructor
PostPosted: Tue Jun 16, 2009 1:23 pm 
The Man
User avatar

Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2005 5:43 am
Posts: 7970
Location: Minneapolis MN
Jonahwaters wrote:
Joel, i do really wonder why you bother advertising on guntalk.
Well, that's easy -- it's because the hits and signups driven from those justify the minimal effort and zero expense. I'm not sure exactly why all the kiddies' yammering is helping drive traffic to various websites and some small number of signups for classes (although I do have a theory or two) but it's definitely worth the maybe ten minutes per month it takes to cut, paste and post. (That it apparently drives gibbering nutcases who I'm none too fond of -- Shapero/Pinnacle, WWJD/Jeremy Poole, Pat Couteaux, Dallas Laurents/Hummer, say -- into conniptions is a mild plus, but only a mild one -- it wouldn't be worth the ten minutes/month it takes for that.)

Now, if listings there cost something, I'd have to do some analysis, and might or might not share the numbers with others. But they don't; they're free, and worth that cost.

ETA: if you've got anything else you're wondering about, feel free to ask, if you care to; I'll feel free to answer, if I care to. Fair?

_________________
Just a guy.


Offline
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: looking for a quality carry permit instructor
PostPosted: Tue Jun 16, 2009 1:31 pm 
Longtime Regular
User avatar

Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 9:54 am
Posts: 5270
Location: Minneapolis
Well, one nice thing about both boards now is you can choose a specified user and put them on your ignore list and not have to read their posts at all. It spared me some real irritation AFAIK on MGT and probably will here too. :wink:

_________________
I am defending myself... in favor of that!


Offline
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: looking for a quality carry permit instructor
PostPosted: Tue Jun 16, 2009 1:46 pm 
The Man
User avatar

Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2005 5:43 am
Posts: 7970
Location: Minneapolis MN
DeanC wrote:
Well, one nice thing about both boards now is you can choose a specified user and put them on your ignore list and not have to read their posts at all. It spared me some real irritation AFAIK on MGT and probably will here too. :wink:
If you're going to do that here, please note that in the mod/admin group.

_________________
Just a guy.


Offline
 Profile E-mail  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Forum locked This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 51 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4  Next

This is a static archive the Twin Cities Carry forum, maintained as a public service by the current forum of record, The Minnesota Carry Forum.

All times are UTC - 6 hours


 Who is online 

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron


 
Index  |  FAQ  |  Search

phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group